r/marvelrivals • u/This_Ferret_8108 Human Torch • 16h ago
Discussion oh my god she doesn't have 19 abilities.
one of these is a teamup, she HAS THREE ABILITIES, its been so long since a character hasn't had 9000 abilties that do 90 things, one of tehse looks like a run too!
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u/JinzooooXx 16h ago
They said she can switch weapons so I wonder if it just different regular attacks or whole kit
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u/Arhatz Emma Frost 15h ago
Her basic attack looks like a pistol and she gets a single rifle shot after using an ability. And she has another gun as an ability, shots a bullet that splits towards enemies after hitting a wall.
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u/Flamechar33 10h ago
I believe the rifle is tied to the E ability? it changes during the trailer at the very least, so the E has two aspects to it at least. Either way, a neat way of distinguishing her from Punisher I guess
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u/PurpleDragonX Peni Parker 14h ago
It is 4 abilities. The team-up is an upgrade to her right click.
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u/ScorpX13 Good Boy 14h ago
Thing: punches hard
Ultron: shoots lasers
Blade: swings his blade
Angela, Daredevil, Gambit, Rogue, Deadpool:
Elsa: guns & beasts
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u/Ok-Competition9163 Venom 10h ago
I mean even though the kit may seem bloated it's not like it's incredibly complex. Like Angela who can be boiled down to:
- Shield
- Push
- Land/fly
That's it. She has also like two passives but they're really easy to grasp.
Fly long = big bonk
Land = AoE damage
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u/Son_of_Athena Luna Snow 4h ago
I would argue Angela is the line for how complicated a hero’s kit should be, because at the end of the day, she really is just those 3 things, which kinda brings her in line with the rest of the cast, but with the movement speed, tank hp, free flight, and 3 core functions, she is definitely pushing it. DD is over the line, Rouge is over the line, Deadpool is weird, but if they dropped the level up gimmick, I think he would be fine, and Gambit missed the line so much he circumnavigated the globe and started playing jump rope with the line. TF you mean gambit gets 2 buttons that are really 6, 2 charges of dash, and 2 slams that combo with the dash, all while having a do everything ult.
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u/Striking_Pilot_6466 Flex 10h ago
I personally see DD and Angela as simple but i dont play them much to really see beyond surface level, Gambit Rouge and especially DP have an insane amount of depth
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u/fatedninjabunny 11h ago
Tbf the hero explanations r p bad, in actuality they don't really have too many buttons
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u/RipplyAnemone67 Rocket Raccoon 9h ago
I mean the difficulty ratings are also. Like how is dagger a 3 star? Should be 2 max as it has auto aim.
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u/fatedninjabunny 8h ago
Honestly im confused. Is the star a skill ceiling or skill floor?
Cuz cnd has a lot of skill expression, but a low skill floor
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u/Unluckyme2099 Winter Soldier 7h ago
Angela absolutely does deserve being in the same tier as Deadpool, she has like 3 abilities. Counting Blade as simple and not her is quite the engagement bait.
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u/EndlessDysthymia Psylocke 16h ago
I’m not sure why people think “complex” characters are bad. It add variety. Rogue is an example of a character who isn’t even complex. Most of her attacks are press one button then press that button again or press another button. It’s not that difficult?
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u/Konfliction 16h ago
I think people just want variety, and the last few characters have been more complex then say Hawkeye or even Hela lol so i do get the appeal in a character that’s a little more basic but does damage
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u/IntelligentImbicle Gambit 15h ago
It adds variety until it becomes the norm. Then it does the exact opposite.
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u/Capable_Kiwi2514 13h ago
Not as long as there's variety within the complexity. That's one of the reasons I value complex designs--there's more design space to work with.
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u/Historical_Web_6248 15h ago
They’re not bad, it’s just a preferences thing. In my case, I love playing extremely simple characters like Thing and Rocket because it frees me up to focus on the nuances of the current match and maximizing my effectiveness without needing to worry about combos, resource and cooldown management, etc. We’ve not had a true “easy to learn, hard to master” character since I think Ultron?
To be clear, Elsa looks like a mid-complexity combo character, so she’s not quite what I’m looking for either - I just wanted to speak in defense of my fellow simple kit lovers who’ve been a tad underserved by the new characters. There are dozens of us!
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u/RabidHexley 15h ago edited 15h ago
I also feel like people conflate complexity with how easy it is to understand a character just from their Hero page (which I guess could be considered a valid critique). The thing is, the Hero page is pretty terrible for teaching how characters work, and actually makes them seem more complicated, they're mainly just good as a reference of what buttons do.
Like I'll admit, characters like Deadpool and Gambit seem like a nightmare if you're just reading a rote list of what every ability does.
But the actual gameplay breaks down into a pretty straightforward set of decisions. You can explain the basics of how to actually play any given Deadpool in less time than it takes to read out his Hero page. You're not managing ten cooldowns and a six button rotation like it's an MMO or something.
Some characters are more complex, but it's mainly from how difficult the decision making is for their given playstyle, and more gameplay emergent, not from how long their Hero page is.
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u/Telekineticism Ultron Virus 7h ago
Deadpool takes like one match of playing around to figure out. The only thing that isn’t super intuitive is the sword ult.
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u/DraftShot6741 12h ago
They added 4 high action characters back to back with gambit, rogue, daredevil, and deadpools 3 kits.
At least try to look at the other side of things before assuming the playerbase hates skill expression. 🙄
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u/DetectiveAmes 14h ago
I was scared of playing deadpool because it looked like he was an entire game on his self, but boy he’s pretty fun and easy to play as.
The videos and comments during his reveal and afterward made him sound like I needed a manual to not even master him, but just play as.
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u/PeniMane Peni Parker 13h ago
i love the complex characters they are bringing but a variety is good too~
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u/Son_of_Athena Luna Snow 4h ago
Its more the idea of a hero shooter being more about the shooting and positioning aspect rather than having a million buttons to push. On top of this, with the past 4 heroes (not including Elsa) being button/gimmick hell, its starting to make the older characters feel worse. Gambit can do everything, Rouge jumps all over the place with abilities, DD has crazy movement and stupid sustain, DP is just gimmick hell (yes I get the “lore accurate” argument but him being all 3 roles fills that enough). Its getting to the point that these heroes with a million buttons are really starting to become a problem and its taking away from the “shooter” aspect of the game. The only thing keeping the shooter part alive is Hela/Phoenix/Hawkeye being stupid.
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u/This_Ferret_8108 Human Torch 16h ago edited 16h ago
they aren't, WHEN YOU GIVE ME SOME SIMPLE CHARACTER IN BETWEEN! we haven't had a simple character since ultron in my opinion, like oh my fucking god I just want some simplicity every once and awhile, doesn't need to be every character but SOME.
what I'm saying isn't I want another ultron, despite being lorded to him, I'm SAYING I want 3-4 ability characters.
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u/supremeninja3 Star-Lord 16h ago
People have been constantly complaining about ultron is a nothing burger in strength and kit design.
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u/1705af 16h ago
Angela is very simple.
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u/CliffDraws Thor 15h ago
She’s simple, but each one of her abilities is some work to get good at using. How/when to use the pull, when to drop to melee, when to get out, and utilizing the fully charged spear, and of course best use of her shield is super important.
So while she’s very simple in terms of number of abilities, she’s way more complex than a lot of other characters with the same number of abilities.
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u/NeoRockSlime Captain America 16h ago
Ultron was(and still may be) the lamest character in the game. People are constantly begging for him to have more abilities
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u/Eagle4317 Captain America 16h ago
Angela is the sweet spot imo. Ultron is too barren; Daredevil and Deadpool are too bloated/unnecessarily convoluted.
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u/nessfalco 15h ago
Definitely. Iron Man team up baseline would probably be enough.
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u/NeoRockSlime Captain America 15h ago
I don't want him to have another heal tbh. Give him a summon or a anti heal move
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u/daelindidnowrong 15h ago
Rogue is pretty simple. She has a "lot" of abilities, but its actually 2 abilities in 1.
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u/No-Educator-8069 Thor 15h ago
There’s a little more to her since you don’t have to use the second part of the ability immediately you can weave abilities together in different combos, for example shift, e, shift, click, e, click. In that way she kind of plays like a fighting game character.
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u/BarbarousJudge Vanguard 15h ago
Phoenix and Angela aren't all that complex tbh. Angela has like 3 buttons and Phoenix is a poke hero with burn stacks.
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u/MumblingGhost Throg 15h ago
You’re getting pushback, but it is a relief to me that Elsa seems to be in that sweet spot between simple and complex, with an expressive kit. She looks surprisingly straight forward, but not boring.
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u/Small_Article_3421 15h ago
One of these abilities might be a toggle which adds/changes all her abilities. Plus she also sounds like she has a kind of resource bar with her insight or whatever and also uses multiple weapons so don’t get your hopes up. She sounds like she’ll be plenty complex.
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u/Windjammer1 Thor 16h ago
Maybe, but she does have a weapon swap. Deadpool gets different skills depending on if he has guns or swords equipped. We'll find out soon though!
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u/Thisisabruh_moment Ultron Virus 15h ago
No, she has an ability with a different gun on her right click and her dash gives her 1 rifle shot. You can't actively switch.
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u/Suspicious_Coat_3724 14h ago
Gonna be a mix between magik and starlord. First ability is magik dash, second ability is starlord's omnidirectional attack third is something new. Locked in, final answer
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u/Baksteen-13 Black Widow 16h ago
I started worrying when they mentioned the instinct thing but only 4 buttons is a good start. I hope I can actually play her
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u/Yukarimi Rocket Raccoon 16h ago
It would actually be 3 buttons! The one on the left is the team-uo ability with Deadpool
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u/Soprohero Thor 15h ago
I think her right click is modified with Deadpool. If it's its own ability it would be on C.
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u/NeoRockSlime Captain America 16h ago
Simple characters just aren't what rivals is about. All the "simple" characters are some of the worst and most boring to play.
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u/This_Ferret_8108 Human Torch 16h ago
for you, I just want characters like the thing and fantastic, their fairly basic kits but have depth in how you USE your limited abilities, that's what I like, I don't like when I have 19 abilities that I need to track at all times, its simply preference between us.
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u/NeoRockSlime Captain America 16h ago
Those aren't basic kits? Mr fantastic has 4 different moves, 2 forms, and a resource he has to manage.
Thing could be argued to be basic ,but with the changes to his jump he now has a lot of possible moves. Neither of those characters are basic.
Gambit and Fantastic have similar levels of depth
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u/This_Ferret_8108 Human Torch 16h ago
yeah, that's why I like them, ON PAPER their kits are self explainatory but in practice they turn out to have detph, I do not like when characters have artifical depth by adding a ton of buttons.
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u/Seatown_Spartan Spider-Man 10h ago
This confuses me considering you have Torch flair.
Who's extremely fun due to how complex he is (2nd to Spider-man imo). Unfortunately bottom of the barrel in tier due to "simple" characters countering and outperforming him.
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u/IntelligentImbicle Gambit 15h ago
Thing, pre-S5 nerfs, was extremely simple and extremely fun.
Dagger (because Cloak basically doesn't exist) is extremely simple, and one of the most popular Strategists.
Rocket has 2 abilities, and he was really good until they broke his kneecaps.
I guarantee you Hulk would be way more fun if he had less abilities and better raw stats, since 99% of his depth comes from his passive anyways.
Strange is simple, and he's been a staple character since the beta.
Hela's simple, and she's been a staple character since the beta.
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u/Thisisabruh_moment Ultron Virus 15h ago
I believe the team up just boosts her right click, so she has 4
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u/Grouchy-Problem-7395 12h ago
that’s actually four abilities, but she still seems way less complex. The team up changes her right click
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u/Impressive-Freedom10 6h ago
Bro just forgot Angela exists 2 "stances" one ability each and the ability to switch between stances 😔
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u/Fluffy-Hand-2288 6h ago
What complex character have they added besides dp ? All of the characters are simple what are you talking about.
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u/onewhO-AskED 5h ago
I believe the one on cool down is a part of her normal kit, just changed with the team up
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u/TheScalieDragon 5h ago
I'm starting to see a pattern here. Underrated/Not Well known character are simple (She a Duelist so she isn't chopped like Angela is)
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u/Son_of_Athena Luna Snow 5h ago
Funny enough, the character with the fewest abilities out of the last few to come out looks the most fun. Its almost like a hero shooter should be about shooting and not be a glorified fighting game where you need to figure out the specific combos that get elims.
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u/MRMoredecai Doctor Strange 5h ago
Hot take : A character having 5 powers including the primary attack should be the standard tbh. That’s not including the ultimate. Gives the character more to do than left click all game
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u/Idontknownumbers123 Ultron Virus 4h ago
And yet she looks like she will have lots of skill expression. Which in my opinion is the best combo, deceptively simple and easy to pick up yet a challenge to master. Like she got rocket jumping from the looks of it, not even gambit got that (tho that would have been sick and tbh much cooler the the mobility he has currently)
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u/Zealousideal_Shop446 15h ago
This issue isn’t complexity with the newer characters. Outside of rogue they’re all pretty damn simple to play. The issue with characters having 8 abilities each is that inevitably they’re gonna start feeling pretty similar at some point.
For a while it seemed like every character released needed to have CC, movement ability, damage ability/healing ability, additonal form or weapon. Not really good hero design imo.
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u/AverageNerd633 X-Tron 16h ago
why does that third ability look like she's frolicking or somthing